How to get distance on the beach?

[Birdbrain]

The never ending quest, of reaching out to touch the coho !

You know those articles and people who talk about different rods or lines, that will have us all "firing out 100 foot casts", blah, blah, blah. Well, the experts all make it sound and look easy, but the reality is that we are not all Steve Rajeff, or any of those other superb casters. Same as the greats of hockey or any other sport; some just have an amazing natural talent for timing and technique, that 99% of us just don't have. We can practise all our lives, but I don't believe we will ever make those hero casts; just slowly make small improvements.

So, as an average-to-below average caster, I'm interested in anything that can make a small improvement in my casting distance, while still keeping things enjoyable.

I have a few single handed rods (7 & 8 weights; a couple of them cannons), and I'm thinking of trying a switch. They confuse me, because apparently, some work with their rated line weights, while I understand that others need a line that's 1, 2, or 3 line weights heavier than their rating. Why are they rated so bizarrely?

While I research switch rods, I'm getting a new line or two to try (eg. Rio Outbound).

What has made a difference in your casting distance (apart from good old practise). And what is enjoyable, and what drives you nuts (running line blowing in the wind, heavy action rod killing your shoulder, etc.)?

Different line? Which one?
Shooting head? Which head, which running line?
Different single handed rod? Which one?
Switching to a switch rod? Which one?

Thanks in advance, people!

[Troutman Clay]

A few things that have had a great impact on my casting is using a stiff rod with a larger rated line, Salar has set me up with a spey line on my single hand and man can I bomb line with that puppy. Another line I would recommend on personal experience is the cortland ghost tip, if your not overloading your rod with a spey line, this line casts like a dream for me. And by using a heavier line wt that you rod, you get a lot more of a load up and you can shoot out your line much further and efficiently, but only to a certain point before it cancels itself out by using to heady of a line.

As far as rods go, I'm using a Cortland CL in an 8wt on the beaches, but hopefully soon here I can get another better rod, but this one has been great, loads up nicely, has a fair bit of bend but as far as overloading lt doesnt fair too well with my spey line as It feels like im using a fiberglass rod with the load up times. With that being said I do very much enjoy this rod and It worked great for me and casting was a dream with both my lines, just need to look for a stiffer rod next.

And one last thing I use in order to improve my casting when I'm wading is to never wade past my knees unless its a really flat beach with almost no drop, as your cast is severly hampered, in my opinion by being that close to the water. The 10 feet you gain by wading up past your waist will effect your cast, i.e from being able to cast 70+ feet, down to maybe 45 if your lucky, not to mention that your simply pushing the fish out farther and will get more frustrated than its worth.

As for what annoys me the most is when your fishing right from shore early in the morning as the school is huging tight to the beach and as more people wake up and come down the wade right into the school without even looking, and instead of leaving the water and letting the fish get in closer, they wade out farther until the cant no more. And they stay in the water even though their casting abilities are to hampered to make a 60 foot cast that far out.

Clayton

[Chumley]

Let me say first of all, I admire your humility.

Here's my two cents worth:

IMO it is mostly practice and time spent on the water that improves your casting. With that being said some people have a 'knack' for picking it up faster than others. Taking a lesson(s) from an expert is also something I'd recommend. "There's always room for improvment". Also ask fellow anglers to critique your casting techniques. From time to time I'll ask. Sometimes I fall into bad habits in my casting stroke and need to adjust my techniques, not much different than a baseball pitcher's delivery.

In regards to line ratings on switch rods, no question it's confusing. It's not an easy explanation. Most manufacturer's list the grain wt. range for each model and suggest certain lines for different applications(overhead or underhand). Generally for casting over head it's the lower grain wieght in the range as to underhand it's the higher. For example: Sage Z-Axis 11' 5wt. switch rod has a grain wt. range of 275-325, give or take. Most switch rods in this length and wt. are similar in the grain wt. range. I use a #6 Outbound and a 40+ for overhead casting on my Sage Z-Axis. Rio's website has a line/rod recommendation chart that is a great reference. If your rod is not listed just use another manufactures rod in the same wt. and length.

I consider myself a pretty good caster. I prefer a fast action rod for the beach as line speed = distance. A double haul is also crucial for distance if you cast single handed. I use both single handed and switch rods in both 11 feet off the beach though I don't double hand on the switch rods. I haven't had the discipline to D.H. overhead as I reach far distances single handed double hauling. However I do plan on changing that.

A stripping basket IMO is huge if your wading off the beach. I've been using one for 20 years. I've somewhat amazed that anglers don't use them more, but over the last few years it seems more guys are using them. I will say that it is more tricky using a basket going D.H. overhead. I'd say I get at least an extra 10 feet with the basket. Also with the basket the tide doesn't pull on your line, the running line doesn't get tangled in your legs and feet, the wind doesn't wreak havoc with the line by being in the basket. It saves a hell of a lot of work IMO.

Lines are personal choice. For me, I use a intergrated shooting head/running lines like the Rio Outbound and the Airflo 40+. I've heard good things about the Beulah Elixer lines also. I don't bother splicing or looping shooting heads to running lines now. I use to before these intergrated shooting heads have come on the market. With these shooting heads you use a different casting method as to the basic wieght forward line. Basically one false cast and let 'er sail. The head has to be just past the tip of the rod. I use a double haul. Of course that wouldn't be the case if you're double handing overhead.

Another factor for distance is a clean, slick line. I notice after about three hours my distance does lack and I believe it's from a dirty line. In the salt your line does pick up a lot of small particles thus causing more friction through your guides. I clean and dress my line after every outing.

My advice for buying a switch rod for the first time is don't spend too much money on it as it might not be your thing. You can always up grade later.

Anyway, I hope that this is some help for you.

Goodluck

[11th Warrior]

From everything I've read here, one critical factor for distance has only been touched on briefly by Chumley....rod length. Line speed is certainly one of the top 3 factors when you're casting for distance, but by using a longer rod, you can generate higher line speeds, which in turn generate greater distance using less effort.

As an example, my 7wt is a 9'6" rod and I can sling about 65' of line with a bit of effort. My father-in-law has an 11ft 7wt and using my reel/line, I can throw line from here to the moon (in excess of 90'). Surf fishermen in California use rods in the 12-14' range.

[btree]

Two words: "Double Haul"

[Chumley]

From everything I've read here, one critical factor for distance has only been touched on briefly by Chumley....rod length. Line speed is certainly one of the top 3 factors when you're casting for distance, but by using a longer rod, you can generate higher line speeds, which in turn generate greater distance using less effort.

As an example, my 7wt is a 9'6" rod and I can sling about 65' of line with a bit of effort. My father-in-law has an 11ft 7wt and using my reel/line, I can throw line from here to the moon (in excess of 90'). Surf fishermen in California use rods in the 12-14' range.

You're bang on. East coast surf flyboys do use 12'-14' D.H. for stripers, bluefish, etc. off the beach. Though it seems the 11' foot range D.H.s are most often used. Several companies do manufacture speciality 'surf rods' like Beulah, CND, and Loomis and they're in the 11' range. These rods are primarily designed to cast overhead. Fast and very powerful. DISTANCE.

[Birdbrain]

In regards to line ratings on switch rods, no question it's confusing. It's not an easy explanation. Most manufacturer's list the grain wt. range for each model and suggest certain lines for different applications(overhead or underhand). Generally for casting over head it's the lower grain wieght in the range as to underhand it's the higher. For example: Sage Z-Axis 11' 5wt. switch rod has a grain wt. range of 275-325, give or take. Most switch rods in this length and wt. are similar in the grain wt. range. I use a #6 Outbound and a 40+ for overhead casting on my Sage Z-Axis.

That's a really good example. 275-325 grain lines are AFTMA rated for 10 and 11 weights, so why in the world would a rod manufacturer call that rod a 5wt.? A confused customer doesn't buy.
I totally understand that you also use a 6wt. regular line on that rod. It's quite common knowledge to up-line one weight, especially on fast action rods.
By the way, are you using that "5wt." for coho? I'm looking at another brand of "5wt." 11 foot switch; the St.Croix. I know, apples and oranges....it sure ain't a Z-Axis, but affordable....if it's suitable.

Great suggestions, Chumley, and others. Most of that stuff, I know, but reminders are very helpful. I have double hauled for years, use a stripping basket sometimes (damn nuisance), and clean my lines after every couple of trips.

I understand the advantages of a long rod, but I wouldn't go for those 11' single handed rods, at least not in the usual 7-8 wt. we use for coho. That would kill my arm and shoulder. I already have to pace myself, when I use my GLoomis 9'9" 8wt. I'm not 20-something anymore! That's why I'm looking into a switch or double handed. And I'll warn you young guys, (not that you'll believe me, because when we're young, we all think "it can't happen to me, cause I'm young and tough"), that joint injuries can start at a young age, and then nag you forever.

So I think my next steps would be to:
1. Have an expert caster check my cast (maybe I've picked up some bad habits, over the several decades I've been fly fishing).
2. Try to find an 8wt. Outbound Short line (looks like an online order)
3. Try to understand these switch and double handed rods.

I really don't want to go with heads on the beach, if I can help it. I can cast them fine, but I dislike managing their skinny running lines.

Thanks a lot, guys. Let's hope for a decent coho season!

[Chumley]

^^^ Ya, it can be overwhelming. Talk to other people who use switch and D.H. rods off the beach and get thier point of view. Lots of info on the web as well, especially on the Spey pages forum.

Good luck

[Birdbrain]

Thanks again for your detailed help, Chumley.
Is that 11' 5wt. of yours enough stick for coho?

[Chumley]

Thanks again for your detailed help, Chumley.
Is that 11' 5wt. of yours enough stick for coho?

Ah, yes and no. I can put out close to 100' on a good day. No wind, shallow wading. But when those damn easterlies/south easterlies start howling up here on the beaches it doesn't have the power to drive thru the wind. That's when I step up to a 11' 7wt. Also considering the size of the fish, smaller Coho, 4-10lbs., yes, but bigger fish I'd say no as I like to use a rod weight that has enough power to handle bigger fish to get 'em in fairly quick and release them. I've seen guys use light weight rods for Coho and they hook a big fish and the time they get it in the poor thing is absolutely exhausted. It's an ethical thing for me. The rod is perfect for Pinks.

I'd be O.K. with a 6wt. 11' rod.

What are you using at the present time?