steelhead questions

[lcampbellcutthroat]

Hi, being new to the two hand rod and fly fishing for steelhead specifically I just had a couple of simple/loaded/dumb questions

1-is the relatively low number of fish that seem to be taken with flies due to fishers not knowing holding water or because steelhead just simply dont hit flies as often as gear, or some other reason eg. skill level of angler, moon phases, fishing water incorrectly, etc.

2-in your collective experience are hatchery fish more dour/difficult to catch during temp/turbidity shifts on the fly (as I have read about but not actually seen) or is there really not much difference


I know steelhead holding water from my experiences with gear fishing quite well, but have no success with the fly, and gear guys fishing non bait items eg. spinners, gooey bobs, corkies, wool in said areas do quite well, I'm trying both dead drift and the swing, anyway it isn't my intent to offend or figure out people secrets I'm just curious and 0-30 with not a single pluck or hookup
thanks, Len

[btree]

I share your pain there Len. I've been trying quite seriously for a few years now without a bite from a steelie, so I'm interested in the answers to your questions there.

[SalaR]

Hi, being new to the two hand rod and fly fishing for steelhead specifically I just had a couple of simple/loaded/dumb questions

1-is the relatively low number of fish that seem to be taken with flies due to fishers not knowing holding water or because steelhead just simply dont hit flies as often as gear, or some other reason eg. skill level of angler, moon phases, fishing water incorrectly, etc.

2-in your collective experience are hatchery fish more dour/difficult to catch during temp/turbidity shifts on the fly (as I have read about but not actually seen) or is there really not much difference


I know steelhead holding water from my experiences with gear fishing quite well, but have no success with the fly, and gear guys fishing non bait items eg. spinners, gooey bobs, corkies, wool in said areas do quite well, I'm trying both dead drift and the swing, anyway it isn't my intent to offend or figure out people secrets I'm just curious and 0-30 with not a single pluck or hookup
thanks, Len

Hi Len..I think I can shed some light on this for you ,especially considering that you have used gear successfully...The main reason Steelhead don't take the fly as readily is because we have difficulty getting the fly Immediately down to the fish. And when you do it needs to have a very natural drift...much like a corkie will have once sunk to the bottom behind a piece of Pencil lead or a Pink Worm..or what ever! Winter fish typically will hold just off the bottom but not directly on the bottom...so a 42" leader off a chunk of pencil lead will suspend your presentation in the Zone better. A fly will have to be worked into the zone via mends and other manipulated skills.
So,the big question is Should we use a Skagit line with 15' of T17 to somehow get the fly past the surface tension working it's way into the Zone from Above or should we use a less heavy line but increase the density of our fly to break that water tension and have it drop into the Zone like a rock(This I like)...what we have been working on for many years are ways just to do this...It's not always that simple ,Winter Steelhead do not feed??!! Winter Steelhead will not move too far to intercept something going by.Water clarity,Moon,water temperature all have influence on our successes..
One of my favorite ways to get into the Zone is to use a Short Head Floating line,Long leader and Weighted EumerColoured Tube Body deressed very sparsely with palmered White UV Polar Chenille looking like a skein ...you will lose flies but get more fish
C

[btree]

I agree with your technique there C. I'm thinking of looking at a skandi line once I sell my damn car.

But the big question on my mind is what sort of leader are you using to turn over a heavy fly? I'm finding that with the usual tapered leaders, they just do not have much poop to turn over a heavy fly once they get much longer than 12-14 ft. Mind you, I'm trying this with a that 2D snowbee line - not exactly ideal for tossing a heavy fly, so perhaps it's more then line than the leader, but even when I go to flies that that only have a smaller bead head rather than a dumbell or cone, the leader does not turn over and continue to transfer power quite as well as with a ~10 ft leader.

So how long a leader can one expect to cast? And are there specially designed leaders with more powerful butt sections that one should use to turn over a heavy fly on a 15+ ft leader?

I assume that those poly leaders will help turn over the fly, but since they are a bit thicker than mono, they tend to be affected by currents and can get swept to the surface despite their density.

Any way, back to tying chronies

[lcampbellcutthroat]

thank you for the replies, i'm not familiar with eumer coloured tubes, only HMH. Are these heavy tubes eg. brass or light tubes with lots of weight added eg. dumbells, either way im assuming you mean quite heavily weighted. is a fifteen foot leader neccesary? most holding water i've seen is barely 15 ft from the bank as I fish smaller rivers
Len

[Finslap]

HI Len,

Great questions, I found Courtney's answer very helpful. I'm sure you've probably found this sight already but here's the info on Eumer:

http://www.eumertube.com/index.php

I started chasing steel this year and my biggests worry is if my fly is at the right depth. Information gems like this help newbs like me out alot. Especially when your used to fishing the diamond hole all the time

[SalaR]

thank you for the replies, i'm not familiar with eumer coloured tubes, only HMH. Are these heavy tubes eg. brass or light tubes with lots of weight added eg. dumbells, either way im assuming you mean quite heavily weighted. is a fifteen foot leader neccesary? most holding water i've seen is barely 15 ft from the bank as I fish smaller rivers
Len

Like so many things in our life we equate success by what we know or are told works. The HMH are fine products but very limited in context and design...Eumer has opened a world of possibility by going outside the limits we had set for ourselves ...some of these acessories are bright coloured and densely weighted..I myself prefer to use a heavy short Cone head and build a large sparse fly arounf it...teh result is that the fly penetrates the faster moving surface water enabling us(me) to manipulate teh presentation more efficiently. Similar to dropping a small Jig into a pool...it gets down quickly . I am aslo at the moment playing with a new product to North America called "tubeology"...with all these accessories we will be abe to bridge many situations effectively and outside our normal limitations without having to use that dreaded word"GEAR"...so,once someone tells me how to upload pictures in this new FFBC format I will try to entertain some of you with some crazy creations that work.
Just yesterday I landed a beautiful Wild Winter Run Steelhead with One of these flies...
But remember,they don't have to be heavy...just hydro-dynamic!
C

[tbar24]

haha so its time for the snake unveiling? what color did you catch it on?

[SalaR]

haha so its time for the snake unveiling? what color did you catch it on?

How do we upload pics to the messages...have to figure that out!!
C

[11th Warrior]

How do we upload pics to the messages...have to figure that out!!
C

I tried to post a reply but it turned into a gongshow with my wife laughing at me. I can't figure out how to do it either. I know it should be as simple as clicking on the "insert image" button and following the bouncing ball but I'm getting errors and funny looking attachments that aren't mine.

I give up C, sorry.